Below are the parts which I think are
of interest. These items show that Kristian Anderson and
Robert Barry could not rule out the lab release hypothesis.
The last item shows the authors are following instructions from "on
high" - Fauci, Collins and Farrar.
As the Select Committee report shows, the article they submitted to
Nature was rejected by reviewer #2 because it did not clearly rule out
the possibility of lab release. The authors' response was to
revise the article somewhat, with the addition of a statement ruling
out the lab release hypothesis, and to send it to Nature Medicine,
which approved it. That statement was:
we do not believe that any type of laboratory-based scenario is plausible.
It seems that pressure from the "higher ups" - Fauci, Collins and
Farrar (Wellcome Trust - why did he play such a powerful role?), who
collectively orchestrated gave feedback on, in one case edited and
eventually approved of the article, plus the Nature rejection, caused
them to write the final version which rules out a lab release, while
there is no evidence that they really believed this. The quotes
below indicate these individuals considered lab release unlikely, but
they acknowledged that there were no solid arguments as to why it could
not have occurred.
I believe that the Proximal Origins article is
fraudulent in at least two respects:
1 - The impetus for the article and guidance on its development came
from people who are not acknowledged or listed as authors.
2 - We can see that key aspects of the content of the article do not
represent the views of the authors (at least as expressed in the
correspondence we have access to) and that this final content, with the
absolute certainty about the origin not being a lab release, was added
to gain publication approval and quite likely to satisfy the desires of
Fauci, Collins and Farrar.
It is highly pertinent that on 22 February, two days after their
article was rejected by Nature, Robert Garry, Kristian Anderson and
Edward Holmes worked on a letter to be sent to Nature, rebutting the
rejection of their article, due to reviewer #2's concerns about the
article not being clear enough that a lab release was absolutely not
the cause.
See the quotes below. It is clear that on 22 February they
objected to the suggestion that they rule out lab release. Yet on
27 February they submitted a revised version of the article ruling it
out, to Nature Medicine.
Page 45 of the Select Committee report quotes Kristian Anderson's
response to Committee questions on these events. There's no
indication of what new evidence or arguments changed the author's minds
about this. So it is reasonable to assume that they caved in to
pressure from Nature and from Fauci, Collins and Farrar, to add such a
statement although they did not agree with it.
One important point which the authors and the Select Committee seem not
to be aware of is that the exact codons which specify the proteins of
the furin cleavage site are one of multiple ways of specifying this. In
SARS-CoV-2, the site is specified in a way favoured by genetic
engineers, which is almost the least likely set of codons to be found
in Nature. (
https://www.preprints.org/manuscript/202102.0264/v1
and some other reference I can't find now.) This is a very strong
argument for the furin cleavage site having been the product of direct
genetic engineering: a chimeric virus made from multiple pieces of the
genomes of at least two different viruses, likely with short,
specifically synthesised RNA/DNA spliced in, such as for the furin
cleavage site.
Here are the quotes of interest. Page numbers refer to the full
image found behind a box on the page of the Select Committee report
with that number on the bottom right.
I have added red colour to highlight the most significant text.
2022-02-02 (page 20. PDF page 22):
Kristian Andersen:
"Both Ron and Christian are much too conflicted to think about this
issue straight - to them, the hypothesis of accidental lab escape is so
unlikely and not something they want to consider. The
main issue is that accidental escape is in fact highly likely - It’s
not some fringe theory. I absolutely agree that we can't prove one way
or the other, but we never will be able to - however, that
doesn't mean that by default the data is currently much more suggestive
of a natural origin as opposed to e.g. passage. It is not - the furin
cleavage site is very hard to explain."
Interesting. I'm all for GOF experiments, I think they’re really important* - however performing these in BSL-3 (or less) is just completely nuts! IMO it has to be performed at BSL-4 with extra precautions.
* I have evolved a bit on this point. I used to think they’re
really important, but I'm actually not so sure anymore. I thought it
was really important that we understood whether e.g., avian influenza
could be transmissible between humans - and importantly which steps
(and how many] would need to be involved - but honestly I’m not sure
that type of knowledge is at all actionable, while, of course, being
exceptionally dangerous. It only takes one mistake.
2020-02-02 (page 38 bottom frame)
Andrew Rambaut:
The truth is never going to come out
(if escape is the truth). Would need to be irrefutable evidence. My
position is that the natural evolution is entirely plausible and we
will have to leave it at that. Lab passaging might also generate this
mutation but we have no evidence that that happened.
"I think it would be. good idea to lay
out these arguments for limited dissemination. And quite frankly so we
can learn from it even if it wasn't an escape - it easily could have ..."
[The last word is obscured, and probably starts with 'b'. So it is probably was "been".]
Yeah, I'm conflicted - 1 honestly don’t
know if any of this information is useful without having read all the
various papers. Personally, it’s useful for context, but even though
there's some strange research going on here, there’s no smoking gun.
Not quite sure what such a gun would look like though. Bob said
it well though - I'd prefer this thing being a lab escape so we have
less reason to believe other coronas might do this again in the future.
What is useful is to summarize the main points considered and
discussed. I'll get back on that document tomorrow - for now I still
need to read more and also want to take a closer look at the
alignments.
Bottom line is that we can’t prove whether this is natural or escape - leaving it to others to make that decision, but hopefully we can ensure they're more informed.
2020-02-04 (page 24 top frame)
Kristian Andersen:
I was on a conference call hosted by the National Academy of Sciences
yesterday and a statement about this not being "engineering" should be
coming out from them - I believe Tony called that meeting. Let's see
what comes out of that as well.
The idea of engineering and bioweapon
is definitely not going away and I'm still getting pinged by
journalists. I have noticed some of them starting to ask more broadly
about "lab escape" and for now I have just ignored them - there might
be a time where we need to tackle that more directly head on, but I'll
let the likes of Jeremy and Tony figure out how to do that.
2020-02-05 (page 25)
Robert Garry:
Accidental
release is a scenario many will not be comfortable with but it would be
irresponsible to dismiss the possibility out of hand.
2020-02-06 (page 36 top frame)
Kristian Andersen:
Agreed - this'll amplify over the next couple of weeks.
I just wish there was a way to
conclusively say one or the other, but without that intermediate host
or very earlier cases, there’s just no telling IMO. Which all
means it's back to opinions - and honestly, for this type of question I
don't think opinions are helpful - unless they have some damn strong
science behind them.
Robert Garry:
"So. he argued, it could have entered
humans from the cave in Yunnan or another cave, or a wet market. Or,
alternatively, it could have escaped into a human from the lab".
Three hypotheses here.
1. not likely a bat virus right into a human - could have happen long ago but not so likely.
2. Wet market -ok maybe an intermediate host. I think pangolin viruses
sequences still too far afield but could be part of an animal
circulation that generated the virus.
3. lab passage I'm open to and can't discount
- that just because I don t know the data and few others do. Either
furin sites have been generated or they haven't. If they have I'm
suspicious of lab escape, but not conclusive evidence. If furin sites
have not been generated on cell culture passive, then were looking at
either a long circulation or a very intense circulation in either
humans or animals.
2020-02-17 (page 41)
Edward Holmes, in Sydney, apparently after posting the Proximal Origins article on a preprint server:
Anyway, it’s done. Sorry the last bit had to be done without you. . . pressure from on high.
Fair point about bioRxiv. I’ve asked Nature what they want. Virological will work.
2022-02-22 (page 38 top frame)
Robert Garry
Reviewer #2 pretty much got it all wrong - Nature should reconsider. Andrew did a great job upgrading the lab origin response.
Kristian - what do you think of starting a google for the rebuttal letter?
One page. Seems the 3 major points are 1) pangolin seq give no def
answer, 2) lab escape and 3) new data- if it comes at all - not a
show-stopper.
Just a brief intro letter that points the eds to the key points in the
current response and not so subtle that reviewer #2 clearly was biased
and got it all wrong.
Kristian Andersen
Just created a document, but no text yet. Also shared the whole Google
folder with y'all so it’s easier to access these individual documents.
Waiting to hear from Eddie what's up in China before next steps.
[He linked to a Google Docs URL and there is an icon and text which
seems to represent a document "Nature rebuttal letter" being shared
with the Slack group.]
Robert Garry
We need to give Clare [editor of Nature] several reasons to reconsider.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-51596665
® BBC News February 22nd, 2020 -
Coronavirus cases double in one day in South Korea
The PM describes the situation as grave as the total number of confirmed infections rises to 433.
One reason to reconsider is that this epidemic is looking more and more like a pandemic.
Edward Holmes
I II hopefully be able to update on any
new data tomorrow. Pretty obvious it was going pandemic. I think Nature
have just bought Reviewer #2's argument that we just going to fan the
flames by adding speculation.
I've just done some edits on the original version of the rebuttal in Google docs. Looks pretty good to me.
Update history:2023-07-16. New page. Later in the day I added the quote and notes about the rebuttal letter to Nature.